Bill: Good morning brother Lorenzo
Lorenzo: Brother Bill. Welcome to another episode of the brand brothers.
Bill: Yeah when we say morning we mean 3 o’clock in the morning. This is very, very show business kind of show, so we’re up late. Lorenzo, not to put any pressure on you today, but this is show number 2, correct?
Lorenzo: This is show number 2, that’s right.
Bill: And what are we gonna talk about today for our listening audience?
Lorenzo: We’re talking about what branding isn’t: AKA fake branding.
Bill: Ahh, right. Because if we started out with what branding is, which if you go into a company and ask 20 out of 20 people they’ll give you a different answer, we need to know what branding is not – what’s bad branding, let’s say.
Lorenzo: We need to arm our brethren and sistren with the tools.
Bill: Well, sure, and I think if we say we’re on a mission from God, we need to tell them the mission is really to make branding great again in America.
Lorenzo: Well, there’s shysters out there, there’s hucksters. They’re peddling fake branding.
Bill: There sure are. Well, you see it all the time when you see those great commercials on TV, and people say “Oh, I saw a great commercial” and you ask what it was about “oh, it was some guy fighting with like, 30 girls, and then they all fell off a cliff, and then all of a sudden they went to Jupiter, and it was just the greatest commercial.” I said, “what was the product” “Oh, I don’t know, I think it was a beer commercial, no no no it was a commercial for computers, yeah! And anyway, it was so funny, i love that commercial.” I sit there and go…
Lorenzo: Are you gonna buy anything?
Bill: Well, you know, somebody just spent 10 million dollars on that commercial, and they were talked into doing that commercial by an advertising agency that sold them on what that was, and I think usually what they’re talking about we would call bad branding. But the other thing is that’s why we’re here because we’re here to make branding great again. And in an era of fake news, we’re here to stop the scourge of fake branding.
Lorenzo: There is fake branding. It is out there people, it’s real.
Bill: There sure is. Lorenzo, anything you’ve seen lately that you would think would be branding that might not get around to what we’re talking about?
Lorenzo: Well, one that you and I have shared many libations over is the glorious “power of and”. Let’s talk about “the power of and”, Bill.
Bill: You just went straight from… I was going to work our way down. You’ve actually started us in the lowest level of hell. I mean, you go right to the point Lorenzo. I love it, it’s burning hot down here in the lowest level of hell.
Lorenzo: Well, you know, everyone out there goes, “Look at this company, they’re big, they’re a multi-billion dollar conglomerate empire, surely they got it right”. Incorrect.
Bill: Well, it’s also because people have a lot of questions, especially after they hear our show, they’re gonna have more questions, and probably they are going to question what’s the meaning of life, why am I listening to podcasts, but anyway. A lot of people sit there and say, “Well, those great huge companies with all those budgets, of course they can do this, but i’m just a little tiny company. I don’t have a big budget, I don’t have TV and radio to do all those commercials. And you find out, no, the biggest most powerful and wealthiest companies in the world can screw this up so badly.
Lorenzo: That’s true, and as a matter of fact, if you’re the little guy, you oftentimes have an advantage.
Bill: You do, and here’s the advantage I think you have: there’s just you, and you have common sense versus a big agency or a big company where you have 50 people in a committee where everybody can say no, but nobody wants to say yes. Because committees don’t make choices, do they, they’re not very good at choices, and one thing we’re gonna talk about over and over again is that when you define that one big idea that you stand for, that’s one of the hardest things to do. Branding is about making a choice. When you’ve got five or six or seven great things you have to say, the amateur says I want to say them all. Great branders say no, I’m gonna pick the one thing that’s most important, memorable, and that’s the one I’m gonna drive home, and that’s our ultimate message.
Lorenzo: And then the big corporation a lot of times, they pick the safe route. They don’t want to say anything controversial. But when good branding is done well, you make a bold claim, baby.
Bill: Right. And it’s not easy to be a big corporation like AT&T, with millions and millions of divisions. It’s not easy to find that one thing necessarily that you stand for that’s very specific and memorable, but this one, as we said, as my boss Bob Froelick used to say, the aurora borealis of stupidity. Can we name it? What the heck, they’re not paying us. The AT&T commercial that you see everywhere, with millions and millions of dollars spent behind it, and it says, “And that’s the power of and”.
Bill: Well, think about that again. Has anybody seen that out there? Its AT&T. And because they have so little, they have less than nothing that they can say that differentiates that place, nothing. They said let’s see if we can differentiate on the “&” sign, the ampersand.
Lorenzo: How much do you think that consultant got for that? I bet it was a half a million dollars.
Bill: My theory – Bill’s theory of bad branding spending is the stupider the idea, the more they spent. And not only that, and then they have the CMO, the chief marketing officer globally for AT&T, going on all the media, thrilled that they have this amazing new corporate commercial, “the power of and”. I mean, think about it – I think for basically no money, because they probably spent 10 million, 20 million on this. Think about it, all the production, all the people, flying coast to coast to meetings and Hollywood. And of course, they can’t shoot the commercial in Hoboken New Jersey in the studio. No, for authenticity, we have to go to Rome to shoot this. We have to go to Rome! Of course they do, because they’re a big company.
Lorenzo: Well, it’s because it‘s the epicenter of and, you know, everyone knows that.
Bill: Lorenzo, I’m thinking, for less than a dollar, and anyone who’s listening to this now don’t steal this, well, you can go ahead and steal this, there’s plenty of conjunctions. What do call the “or”, “and”, “if”, and all those things? Punctuation marks?
Lorenzo: I failed English.
Bill: Let’s do “the power of or”. Don’t you think? “The power of if”! I mean, it’s kinda obvious that… there’s no power!
Lorenzo: Well, let’s talk about why it’s so bad, other than the fact that we have no idea what these guys are selling us. What are they selling us?
Bill: And I don’t care. So, we’re gonna talk about this stuff as we go forward: we’re gonna talk about that one big idea that you’re gonna own. Branding is about one idea that you stand for that you can own the marketplace. Think of it like a little piece of real estate, that you own the mind of the public out there. You own this little piece of real estate out there, but that’s a very, very special idea out there. We call it a dominant selling idea. Now selling is the big word here because selling is so important. Most marketers out there today forget that they work for sales. There’s no reason for there to be marketing except to help sales, but so many marketing departments forget that. So a dominant selling idea is real simple, and we’re going to go over this more and more, but the thing is that it’s basically five pieces. The first thing is you have to say “I’m best at something.” I don’t care whether you’re a candy store or a plumber, or you’re a little town pizza shop. You’re gonna say I’m the best at something, and if somebody else is best at that thing then you change what you do just a little differently. But I’m best at something, and if you’re in business I promise you there is something, or you wouldn’t have started that business unless you believed that! The next thing is it has to be important. One of my favorite things is that the idea has to be something the people want. So, for example, my favorite example is my store has the biggest selection of brown ties in El Paso. And that’s a superlative, that’s a number one, but nobody wants brown ties, so it has to be something they want. The next thing is that it has to be believable coming from you. The last thing is it has to be measurable. People have to be able to see it working. Like when Fernando Lamas said. “This Chrysler has rich, Corinthian leather”, and you got in the car and they sprayed leather smell. “Oh, I can smell the leather!” It was plastic. Last thing is it has to be something that you can own, so if you have those tests and say, “the power of and”, let me see – First of all, it fails test number 1: What are they best at? “And”?
Lorenzo: Joining words? Joining things, maybe?
Bill: I don’t know! You don’t even know what they do! Implicit in this dominant selling idea, you’re making a promise. Your selling idea makes a promise to someone. And it says, “I promise you, if you buy my product you will get this benefit.” Now we go back and look at “the power of and”. What are they promising?
Lorenzo: So, let’s give some examples. Let’s say they would have called the Brand Brothers, which they should’ve done, and said “what can we own?” They could have owned price, they could own customer service, coolest, fastest tech. These are all things that you could own and be superlative at.
Bill: Now that’s a very interesting thing. So, we’re also gonna talk about, obviously, as we go forward, do more episodes, how you really go about finding your big idea, and how you go expressing it. Sometimes, you pick an idea that is not the newest idea, let’s say service, but sometimes that’s important because you might be in an industry where there’s 0 service, and everybody wants service. And so you say in this industry, hey, we could be the only guys that give you service, and we have a pretty good example of that, don’t we Lorenzo? Tell them! Which company could we be talking about?
Lorenzo: Is it a company that is my alma mater?
Bill: Umm, it could be. Does it begin with R?
Lorenzo: Does it rhyme with mackspace? Once upon a time at Rackspace, and it’s funny we’re talking about AT&T because I remember as a young whippersnapper, a young lad, I was at a company meeting when our CEO and our chairman got up and said, “Hey, we’re gonna differentiate on service, and here’s why:” And our CEO Lanham Napier said, “Raise your hand if you’ve tried to call Time Warner recently”, and everyone raised their hand. He said, “Keep your hand up if a human being actually talked to you”, and everybody’s hand went down. And he said, “we’re going to be a company where we answer the phone on the first ring. And we’re gonna help people”, and we all laughed because in IT it was such a radical concept, that Graham used to call it the denial of service. He said, “We used to have a denial of service model, we just denied you service, and we didn’t want to talk to you”, and the notion that we would actually pick up the phone instead of hiding from you was so radical that people would pay more for it.
Bill: Well, it was radical in that industry. And see, it’s important that we tell our listeners back home. God, I love saying that: our listeners back home.
Lorenzo: Well, they’re with us. They’re right here!.
Bill: Well, they’re right here, and also we had a listener, remember? Last week after our first, we recorded our show and we went to- can I say this on a family show?- a bar, and we got ourselves one listener.
Lorenzo: And my mom said it was great. She says she really loved it, and she’s gonna tune in next time.
Bill: Well, our listener resigned. We know we’re gonna get them back. Anyway, we’re talking about big companies. Rackspace got to be at its peak an 8 billion dollar global company with 6,000 employees all over the world, but they were differentiating on this one thing. It wasn’t generic because no one else did it and everybody wanted it. So what they said was, we’re gonna give you support when nobody else does. And now can I say a little bit of what I’ve learned because I was there for a long time. You told me these stories, Lorenzo. But the VCs (venture capitalists), remember the geniuses? People that don’t believe in real branding and they don’t believe in real differentiation but they just want money. So we said, “We’re thinking about differentiating on service”, and the VCs are so smart and said “no, don’t give them service. That costs you money. They don’t need service, don’t give them any service. Why would you spend money on your customers?”
Lorenzo: Bury your phone number in the website so they can’t find it.
Bill: And Graham and everybody says, “But we care about our customers!”, and they go “ah, who cares. We care about our shareholders”. And then they said, “Well, we discovered one thing: when people call us and we answer the phone and we actually talk to them, they’re very very happy.
Lorenzo: And they buy more.
Bill: That’s right. The next thing is they buy more stuff, and the third thing is they tell their friends. Isn’t that an interesting thing.
Lorenzo: What a shocking revelation.
Bill: So Graham and those guys said, because we’re from San Antonio, branding capital of the world, we’re gonna go do what we think is right, but we did one thing that we’re gonna also teach you when we’re talking about microscripts. They didn’t just say service, they gave it a name no one else could say. They called it fanatical support. Those two magic words where they labeled it with that. Later one we’re gonna talk about what a microscript is, but they labeled it that. And the last thing was you have to make it real. We’re gonna talk about that in branding too. Because just advertising for a brand that doesn’t work is the worst thing you can possibly do. So if you’re gonna claim something you have to perform it. Then that’s where we came up with measurable things. We said the first thing we’re gonna do is answer the phone on one ring. You were there Lorenzo, tell us about that.
Lorenzo: Well, we re-engineered the whole company to reinforce that. And I remember we were working in silos, so you had the account managers over here and the engineers over here, and they divided us up into about five teams, and one team had three account managers, a sales guy, three engineers, a backup engineer. They looked at us and said, “This is your one company.” Think of yourself as one company, and so you have 500 customers assigned to you, and every time a customer would call in, we were their mini call center, so they knew us all by name. I’d be on the phone, customer’s website would go down, I would just look up at the engineer, I would look at him and he would see me and he would start logging into their website right there, and then I would say, “Okay Ms. Customer, I’m gonna patch in Jay Bridges here, and he’s gonna help you.” And all of a sudden, we gave them an experience they couldn’t get anywhere else, and they would’ve done anything to not leave because it was so important to them.
Bill: And maybe to the bean counters and the VCs in New York you were spending money, but you were investing money in something.
Lorenzo: Also, one of the metrics that nobody ever talks about, is because of this our churn went waaay down, so our ability to retain customers added to the bottom line because all of a sudden now, there was this new revelation. If we talk with them, they stay with us.
Bill: This is such an important subject, though, we’re actually gonna talk about this now, but we’re gonna do a whole episode on this because this gets to brands are good. Everybody knows that. You can read branding is good- then what’s a good brand? what’s a bad brand? But actually what you get, what actually happens when you do these kinds of things in your company because it has way, way bigger effects than just a good ad or certain people answering the phone or your emails at a higher percentage. It has massive, massive implications. We’re gonna talk about that another time because it actually sets your whole vision going forward and it gives people a reason they come to work every day. But we’ll go over that later, that’s the power of what a brand really does.
Lorenzo: So Bill, let’s go back to “the power of and” because when I look at what we went through at Rackspace, and I’m an AT&T customer, and I think to myself, if I had to guess, I would say, “hey, they actually treat me pretty well as a customer”, and if I compare them to, say, Verizon, I think Verizon is trying to be the biggest network, where there’s the” can you hear me now” guy, and I go, you missed the boat, on “the power of and”. You could’ve said we own one thing, and they didn’t. They ran the other way.
Bill: Well, okay. The thing is, we said it’s hard for big companies. AT&T does millions and millions of things all over the world, so it’s challenging for a big corporation like that to find something specific because branding is all about finding one thing and making it as specific as you possibly can. So, let’s look at some other corporations that did find that one thing. If you call enterprise rent a car after 30 years, they still pick up the phone and say, “Hi, enterprise. We’ll pick you up.” Now that’s a specific thing, but it was symbolic of a whole different thing. It meant hey, we’re the guys that are not at the airport, and we have a special kind of customer service so that if you’re not at the airport and you need a car for some other reason, your car’s in the shop or whatever it is, we’re the guys that will pick you up and take you there. It was a symbolic thing, but it stood for something much bigger.
Lorenzo: There was one you told me about one time when you were driving on the highway, and you saw a billboard and it was about patients, what was it? Was it one nurse per patient?
Bill: Well, that gets into differentiating. It’s a real promise; all the other hospitals say, “A passion for excellent feelings”.
Lorenzo: Committed to excellence.
Bill: Committed to excellence. No, we drove by this sign out on 1604 and it said, “One nurse for every patient.” See, this is getting into how we actually do this stuff, and how we learn the specific is terrific. And to say 50% off is way, way, way better than saying low prices. You need to be specific because when you’re specific you challenge people, and once again as Rosser Reeves said, either you’re telling me the truth or you’re a liar, so I need to know. It’s one of those things. Are we straying right now?
Lorenzo: We’re straying.
Bill: We’ve been warned not to stray. I see there could be a stray going on. Do you think we’re straying?
Lorenzo: Well, we’re boomeranging.
Bill: We’re coming back. We are gonna tie it together.
Lorenzo: Like a big bow.
Bill: We’re straying and tying, I love this.
Lorenzo: So once a year I want to talk about the super bowl of terrible that happens at the Super Bowl. Right, the super bowl of antics, the super bowl of ridiculousness at the Super Bowl. Which is now an industry, making a gajillion fafillion dollar commercials, being loud, getting a million views on youtube, and you and I still don’t know what are those guys selling.
Bill: This is an interesting one, because every year after the super bowl they ask brand gurus.. They didn’t ask us. They should’ve. They will.
Lorenzo: Well, I block your calls.
Bill: I don’t let them through, I know they’re gonna call. It’s like when you had a roommate and they keep doing all the credit card offers, you’ve got to intercept them and throw them in the trash, but I didn’t want you to hear those calls. But they used to be so ridiculous, the thing was, though, I think that actually in fairness it’s gotten to be a joke, I think even the advertisers know it’s kind of a joke now to get on and entertain people, and just being there. They run a lot of those commercials during the year, but they’re especially wacky and weird at the Super Bowl.
Lorenzo: But the reason that I bring it up because I feel like there are people out there that actually think, “If I could just get a two minute spot on the super bowl, it’s going to change everything for my business”, and maybe it will, but not if you’re doing it that way.
Bill: Lorenzo, I’m glad you said that, because guess what – this brings us back to our subject! Imagine that! It’s fake branding and bad branding. The fake branders come in and they say, “It’s all about awareness. It’s all about page views.” I was in a pitch where three of the biggest agencies in the world came in and I was sitting in that boardroom, again in a very very big company, and they came in to pitch. These were the biggest agencies in the world, and they talked about page views, they talked about awareness, and they talked about entertainment. One of them actually said, in that meeting, to people who were charged for selling this brand, “Selling is an emotional feeling in people, and people don’t care about your brand. We actually caution people on not talking about their product too much because, let’s face it, your product is boring. Our job is to make you laugh, or make you cry.”
Lorenzo: My job is to punch you in the face if you say that ridiculousness.
Bill: And I just said to the guy, “what about buy?” Laugh or cry, but what about buy? At Ted Bates, the Mad Men agency where i grew up, if someone had said that in a meeting, they would have stopped, they would’ve gotten up, everyone would shake hands, they would have taken this person who said that, they would have brought them over to the 29th floor windows you couldn’t open, they would have shattered the window with their frickin’ Scotch bottles, they would have shattered the window until it broke, and then they would have thrown him out.
Lorenzo: And justly so, they deserve that. The great Bill Schley once said, and I quote, “There’s nothing more emotional than I have a headache and I want it to go away”. That produces all the emotion you need.
Bill: What they don’t understand, and the problem is you find out that a lot of these places today actually have a contempt for their customers products. What they really are doing is making great film or they want to make entertaining film to win awards, to win Cleo and Andy awards and that kind of thing, best commercial rewards, which are never about how much you sell. The issue is, there’s two steps in any kind of brand messaging. You’ve got to get awareness, you do have to get my attention, but once you got my attention you have to give me a reason to buy the thing. Like we said, I can get 10 million page views of someone lit a cat on fire and they ran across the street, but no one is going to buy anything you’re selling. The trick is to make the product the most interesting possible thing, and that’s a hard thing to do, but that’s what your job is when you’re branding and doing this stuff. So the fake brands, I think, are just going to get entertainment value, again, just to create awareness. Just entertainment, just show me how clever the copywriter is. The real brands are sitting there saying “look- I’ve got something that’s gonna make your life better. I’ve got a real difference that you need to know about” and then i’m gonna make that thing so exciting that i’m gonna put you in motion to get up to spend your hard earned money. That’s what it’s all about
Lorenzo: I was on twitter the other day and I saw a guy that I respect and he’s a thought leader, and he tweeted that “your product is just this inconvenience, your product is an obstacle and people want to get to the thing” which I actually agree with the latter part of that statement. People want to get to the solution but I don’t think the product is an inconvenience, the product is your star! The product is the thing that’s giving you relief.
Bill: Wait, he said the product was an inconvenience?
Lorenzo: He said it was an obstacle. It was an obstacle from your customers to get to their desired state. And i just went, he’s close.
Bill: Wait a minute, this person is an obstacle to get to my desired state, okay? Can you give me his name and his phone number because I’m gonna go kill him. I have homicidal thoughts. And he’s a marketing guy? Does he take money from good people, honest Americans?
Lorenzo: He does not, that’s why I have not put him on the no fly list, the branding no fly list, the branding blacklist. He’s not on it because he’s not a marketer. He was just giving an observation but I thought, this guy, he needs the brand brothers because he’s shooting around the bulls-eye. The desired state is true, but the product is not an obstacle.
Bill: The product is the whole point! The product solves your problem! You need to have a pill, an ibuprofen pill and it has to be better than the other one so that it can make your headache go away! You need a washing machine to clean your clothes! And you need a car to drive to the supermarket! What is this?! It’d be sad, by the way, if there weren’t real marketing people, these are the people peddling fake branding out there, which by the way, I don’t want anyone out there to listen to those people. These are the brand gurus, the brand charisma, brand energy, brand gestalt.
Lorenzo: The other reason I bring it up is because I saw this tweet and I realized that Twitter launched during South by Southwest, that was kind of their big claim to fame, and I’ve watched South by kind of turn into the new Super Bowl, which is “okay, we’re gonna launch a new product, we’re gonna go to south by, we’re all gonna dress up as flaming chickens and we’re gonna run down 6th street” and I just think that even the new tech companies can fall for the same snake oil salesmanship. And this is why we’re trying to right this wrong. We’re on a mission from god.
Bill: We are. The thing is this: there’s a place for publicity stunts, there’s a place for promotion, there’s a place for some sizzle and fireworks, but we’re talking about your brand. And at the end of the day your brand, which is what your company and your product stands for, it’s the thing that makes you famous. So you can do promotions and run around but in the end, if you’re selling a kind of pizza, let’s say, it better be the best pizza in the world. It better be the only one made in real brick ovens, made with ingredients that come straight from Italy and have never been touched by any chemicals. It better be something like that because in the end they’re gonna laugh at your promotions and then they’re gonna go buy pizza. Your brand is about that thing. What are you famous for? And you only get to be famous for one thing. This is part of the science we’re gonna go over, ladies and gentlemen out there we’re gonna talk about neuroscience too on this show. We’re gonna talk about how the brain works. The brain only lets you be famous for one thing. That’s what the brain does.
Lorenzo: Bill, tell them your famous rule though, it’s an airplane.
Bill: Well, the one item of carry on.
Lorenzo: Exactly, that’s my favorite rule.
Bill: Well, that’s really what Rosser Reeves said was, the famous USP, the unique selling proposition, we call it the dominant selling idea. But what happens is that people remember one thing so you might as well, if you’re gonna stand for one thing, make it the single most unique, memorable and important thing you can stand for, and remind me them over and over again and always come back to that kind of thing because that’s the kind of thing you’re gonna be famous for. When you win the gold medal in something, people attribute a lot of other good things to you. What is the thing we’re number one at? If you don’t give them that one thing, people, their brains, they brand you anyway. Branding is not optional. People are gonna judge you no matter what and that’s just the way we are as human beings. And we do that because our brains have to categorize everything so that we can instantly retrieve it in a moment of emergency or something like that. Famous story was a politician gives a two hour speech and it’s a speech about every single thing in his platform, everything in the world that he’s gonna do for the world with all kinds of things so vote for him. A reporter comes up to a lady afterwards and says “what did he talk about?” she said “he was against taxes”. That’s what the brain does. If you read a 50000 page book on Abraham Lincoln and ask someone who just read that book, you’ll say “who’s Abraham Lincoln” and they’ll say he freed the slaves. The brain creates that one thing. They find a way to categorize you and label you and it’s an instinctive thing and we can’t help it, and so branding is not optional. If we don’t brand it, they’re gonna brand you, which is why we want to control that brand with out message.
Lorenzo: So in an era of fake branding, if I see something and they haven’t given me the one thing, the one idea to sell me something, then you know, the listeners out there know this is fake branding. There’s no product, there’s no one rule of carry on.
Bill: Let me put it this way- it’s not as effective as it could be. You could have good, honest attempts at this stuff. I think when you see the crazy commercial where 8 brides are having a fistfight, I don’t even think they’re trying to brand your product. They don’t even care about it. That’s where the product is in the way, because these guys are trying to make academy award winning films. They don’t care about it. A lot of people will make an honest attempt at selling their product, but for them to really be effective, you have to realize that this can be one really big thing you’re standing for, so you need to decide what that is, and that’s the vision of your company. Volvo said we’re gonna make the world’s safest cars. Timex watches said we’re gonna make the toughest watch for average people, the toughest watch, Takes a lickin’, keeps on tickin’. These are the kinds of decisions that people make to stand for something. You know, Nike says “just do it”, but that’s not their brand, all that is is a piece of advertising. What they first did was they paid the world’s greatest basketball and sports stars, Michael Jordan, remember? And they put those shoes on him and their brand was those are the sneakers that Michael Jordan wears. That was the selling brand. It wasn’t just do it. It’s just advertising. If they hadn’t done that, my plumber could have said just do it. Actually my plumber does say that. He goes “okay, go upstairs and flush the toilet one time, let’s see, just do it, see if the pipes leak”. But that’s what we’re getting to here. So if you want effective branding you’ve got to find that one thing but anybody can.
Lorenzo: Well, thanks to the brand brothers, we’re bringing it back. Our mission is we;re gonna stamp out fake branding.
Bill: We’re on a mission from god, that’s right. To fight the evil forces of fake branding in America. Because let’s face it, folks. America invented entrepreneurship. The thing is, you had to be an entrepreneur to even come here! An entrepreneur is thinking about “how do i sell our products”, and they also invented great branding. And the brands that we remember for a hundred years. If i say Wheaties, people can still say breakfast of champions. How about M&Ms?
Lorenzo: Melts in your mouth, not in your hand.
Bill: Yeah, these are hundred year old brands. I was in India giving a speech once, you don’t know this. I was running away from the law in Pakistan, but I got to India and I was making a speech and I would say “finish my sentence: melts in your mouth…” they’d go “not in your hand”. I mean, 500 people in the audience. I say Wheaties, they go “breakfast of champions”, and that was before the internet. So you see, the power of these things is just immense.
Lorenzo: Well, next episode we’ll be talking about other things.
Bill: Well that’s a weasel right there. You mean we haven’t decided? Yeah, we’re gonna get into a lot of things about, first of all, what branding can actually do for you. There’s always something new to talk about. And we’ll be talking about it on the brand brother.
Lorenzo: Tune in next time.